ArchiCAD 20 slow & Cinerender crash - MY SOLUTIONS

[Anonymous]

Dear ArchiCAD Community.

Before i used AC20 i used AC12. AC12 was very fast compared to vanilla AC20. I could type several keyboard commands in fast order and AC12 did them without hesitation. Panning and zooming was above average. 2D & 3D were fast. Lightworks engine worked without Problem.

After installing AC20 build 3012 i experienced this so often quoted "sluggishnes", and CinreRender did not work, but crashed with the error message "CineRender by MAXON add-on has unexpectedly closed. ArchiCAD schould be restartet".

So i deceided to give at a shot to try and find out what causes this sluggishnes. I used several system monitors and log scriptures to find out what ArchiCAD was doing in the background and what process was causing troubles.

After three Weekends of testing i can give the following Solutions for ArchiCAD 20 build 6005, running on an D / AMD Phenom II X6 1090T 2,0 , 8 GB, Radeon HD 5870, Windows 7 x64, 256 GB Samsung SSD. My AC20 now runs as fast as the old AC12, i might say even a bit faster. The old AC12 was running on the same system configuration by the way.



Getting Rid of Sluggishnes:

1.
Working over a network slows down to a degree, depending on network speed. I use to place the file and folders i am working with on my SSD harddisk drive. . Of course this solution will not work for Teamwork projects.

Speed improvement: moderate but still sluggish


2.
I disabled "Background updating". Whatever ArchiCAD 20 is doing in the Background, logs and monitor show, that it is not very effective and causes a lot of System traffic. It slowed down my AC20.

Speed improvement: moderate but still sluggish


3.
2D & 3D Antialiasing were disabled, 2D hardware acceleration and memory were set to full. Full model for 2D Navigation was set. Automatic renewing of modelsights was also disabled. Of course These actions are pure optional and depending on Hardware.

Speed improvement: significant but still sluggish


4.
Automatic saving was set to all 20min on a local HD Folder. All temporary folders were also set on HD.

Speed improvement: slight but still sluggish


5.
Using a mouse with a polling rate of not over 125 Hz (I use a mouse that allows me to set the polling rate, most mice do not have this option). This was a problem known to Graphisoft with the drawing area screen refreshment rate. It was told me that in build 6005 this problem was adressed and that a high mouse pollin rate does not causes a slowdown anymore. I tested it and it is true.

Speed improvement: significant with AC20 build 3012, none in newer builds, but still sluggish.


6.
Giving ArchiCAD.exe a "High" priority in the "Windows Task Manager".

Speed improvement: slight but still sluggish


7.
Disabling "qtguiagent.exe". There might have been some intern conflict in AC20, systems monitor and log showed considerable traffic sometimes, but since i have a 64bit machine i could disable this process (renamed it qtuiagent.old) without bad side effects. This was done during finding a solution for the Cinerender Problem.

Speed improvement: slight but still sluggish


8.
System monitoring and logs showed, that there was significant traffic with ArchiCAD, its system folders and "MsMpEng.exe". I use Microsoft Security Essentials. So "ArchiCAD.exe" and "ArchiCAD Starter.exe" received exceptions from scanning with MSE. Also all folders and processes concerning ArchiCAD20 received exceptions from scanning with MSE. MSE also was not allowed to scan ist own program folder anymore (Someone in a Forum hinted, that MSE can get clogged down in ist own processes with some programs, so i did this).

Speed improvement: significant , sluggishnes was gone ! This did it for me.

I recommend scanning the excepted folders and files manually from time to time though, as you downgrade System security !



Solving the problem with CineRender:

1.
I tried the solution shown in following topic:
https://archicad-talk.graphisoft.com/viewtopic.php?p=266292
installing Microsoft Visual C++ Redistributable 2012 x86 and x64 and also Intel C++ Compiler for Windows

Effect: Cinerender still crashes


2.
Setting exceptions for all folders, processes and the CinRender.exe in Microsoft Security Essentials.

Effect: Cinerender still crashes


3.
Disabling "qtguiagent.exe" by renaming it in "qtguiagent.old"

Effect: Cinerender still crashes


4.
Allowing my Firewall ( I use COMODO Firewall) all incoming and outgoing traffic of "ArchiCAD.exe" & "CineRender.exe". That was a strange discovery. I usually block all incoming and outgoing traffic with my Firewall (Except local Host 127.0.0.1 or if i want to update etc...). After allowing all outgoing traffic with COMODO, CineRender started to work BUT ONLY, when "ArchiCAD.exe" was STARTED AS ADMINISTRATOR.

Effect: Cinerender works, but you cant drag and drop PDF (Any?) files anymore into ArchiCAD20, this is a side effect of some protection measure from Windows 7 for starting a program as Administrator. I yet have to pinpoint to what IP Adress CineRender or ArchiCAD wants to talk to that caused the problem, but at the moment i am happy as it is.


Conclusion:

In my case the sluggishnes and problems were caused to a great part by my own system protection software. Ressource monitoring and system logs showed me where to problems might be. After doing all of the above steps my AC20 works as fast as the old AC12, even a bit faster and CinRender also works at last. I Hope i could help anyone with the descriptions given above. Please excuse an bad grammar. Any feedback is welcome.

Best regards

Dragan

[Barry Kelly]

Thanks for the detailed analysis Dragan.

In item 8 for sluggishness, you mention the Archicad system files.
By this do you mean ...
C:\Users\username_here\Graphisoft
And … C:\Users\username_here\AppData\Local\Graphisoft
And … C:\Users\username_here\AppData\Roaming\Graphisoft

I am having similar problems with a couple of machines being slow with 20 and so far have had no luck in sorting it out.

Barry.

[Laszlo Nagy]

Dragan,

Thanks for all this information, I think it is very useful.
I myself started experiencing some slowness in the responsiveness of ARCHICAD 21 recently, despite the fact that I have a brand-new, top of the line desktop computer with ample amount of everything and no weak component.
For example, I noticed that the Info Box took more than a second to populate with all the panels and icons, something that was not the case before.
So I just tried your suggestion about the Antivirus exceptions. I added all GRAPHISOFT-related folders to the Exceptions, even the ones Barry refers to, not only the GRAPHISOFT folder in Program Files.
After this ARCHICAD 21 (build 5021) is really snappy, the Info Box populates in a blink of an eye and generally the program is very responsive to my input. So I think you have probably nailed the source of the sluggishness.

I will forward this topic to GRAPHISOFT Tech Support as well, I am sure they will find it very helpful.

Thank you again for all your research and sharing your findings.

[Anonymous]

@Barry Kelly

I disallowed MSE from scanning following folders and files:

C:\Program Files\Graphisoft ArchiCAD20
C:\Program Files\Graphisoft ArchiCAD20\ArchiCAD.exe
C:\Program Files\Graphisoft ArchiCAD20\Cinerender\Cinerender.exe
C:\Users\*USERNAME*\Appdata\Local\Graphisoft
C:\Users\*USERNAME*\Appdata\Roaming\Graphisoft
C:\Users\*USERNAME*\Graphisoft
C:\*THE FOLDER WHEREVER THE .PLN FILE IS YOU WORK AT THE MOMENT*



I disallowed MSE from scanning following filetypes:

*.pln
*.bpn
*.tpl
*.lck



I disallowed MSE from scanning following processes:

C:\Program Files\Graphisoft ArchiCAD20\ArchiCAD.exe
C:\Program Files\Graphisoft ArchiCAD20\Cinerender\Cinerender.exe
C:\Program Files\Graphisoft ArchiCAD20\ArchiCAD Starter.exe



I also disallowed MSE from scanning its following own files and folders:

C:\Program Files\Microsoft\Microsoft Security Client
C:\Program Files\Microsoft\Microsoft Antimalware
C:\Program Files\Microsoft Security Client
C:\Program Files\Microsoft Security Client\MsMpEng.exe

I set ArchiCAD.exe, ArchiCAD Starter.exe & Cinerender.exe to be started as ADMINISTRATOR (But beware the Drag & Drop problem)


Again you must recognize that you downgrade system security, so take precautions.


@Laslzo
Glad i could help you with this. If this problem could be adressed and solved in the future versions of ArchiCAD i would be very glad (And i think not just me).


Addendum:
This was tested on my personal PC i use for Home Office. At work we use iMac OSX 10.12. There the program works faster but i also experienced some Kind of sluggishnes, but not as bad as with the Win 7 Version at first. Big files with a lot of Information tough tend to slow the Mac system down. This problem is gone on my Win 7 PC now, so i think next step is to test some of my findings on the iMacs.

Best Regards

Dragan

[vistasp]

Interesting to read this Dragan. I wonder if this bottleneck is only with MSE or with other AntiVirus as well.

[alemanda]

I tried it and it works. I use MSE as well.
It seems that everything is much faster than before.
I'm under AC21.
THANKS

[Anonymous]

Greetings,

My company received ArchiCAD21 thanks to a ArchiCARD contract a while ago, but it is not yet implemented. So i could give ArchiCAD 21 a testrun yesterday on my pc, to test my found settings.

@alemanda
I therefore can confirm your report. The same settings concerning MSE speed up a slow ArchiCAD 21 on my system.

@vistasp
It would be interesting to test with McAfee, Avira, Symantec, Kaspersky & co.


Concerning further thoughts on the "CineRender by MAXON add-on has unexpectedly closed. ArchiCAD schould be restartet". error message, i see that following executables try to establish a connection when i try to start a rendering or apply a paste texture in 3D in ArchiCAD20:

ArchiCAD.exe
overwatchserver.exe
curl.exe
cinerender.exe
usagelogsender.exe

There seems to be a problem with the loopback traffic, will try some ideas over the next weekends.


Best regards


Dragan

[Anonymous]

Hi! Dragan thanks for sharing all this information and solutions, when I click on ARCHICAD (ac20) it brings up the initial log then about like for several minutes the program start running, this is happening to me. Rencently I had a virus on my pc so I had to run other Antivirus, since then ARCHICAD started failing. I got rid of the virus and unistall the other antivirus and I kept using WINDOWS DEFENDER, I tried all the steps of exclutioning the folders and my archicad stills have a slow start.

I hope you can know anything about this and what can I do.

[Dave Seabury]

After Chasing this for quite some time on a large v19 file I thought for sure it was the video card (Nvidia k620), after upgrading to a p2000 card there was no increase in speed. However, excluding Archicad in my antivirus software fixed the problem completely. We run Eset nod32.

This worked for me.

Thanks
David

[Anonymous]

Next Report after a while:



CineRender

I did some testing with the ArchiCAD CineRender and my COMODO firewall. Loopbacktraffic (intern 127.0.0.1) was allowed in COMODO but cinerender.exe tried, after a set number of actions (It never tried it when i left ArchiCAD 20 just running for itself without using it) in ArchiCAD, to establisch a connection to IP 208.96.19.67, belonging to Datapipe Inc. in New Jersey or Gogrid LLC Los Angeles if i can believe the public available IP finders. If i blocked the connection to this IP my ArchiCAD did freeze and i had to restart. The problem also appeared when cinerender.exe or overwatchserver.exe were disabled via Task Manager.

If anyone from the ArchiCAD staff could tell my why that is it would be very appreciated. I do not like my programs establishing unknown Connections to work without problems.



Further Troubleshooting of Performance and speed


1. HPET SETTINGS

I came across the following thread on the ArchiCAD talk forum:

https://archicad-talk.graphisoft.com/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=59301

where the setting of the hpet (High precision event timer) is mentioned to resolve sluggish performance with AMD Threadripper 1950X. I tried the same thing on my computer an post the results for further reference, running still on
ArchiCAD 20 build 6005, running on an D / AMD Phenom II X6 1090T 2,0 , 8 GB, Radeon HD 5870, Windows 7 x64, 256 GB Samsung SSD, .


HPET was enabled on my PC since it was off by default using .CMD: bcdedit /set useplatformclock true. Following was observable using a frames per second counter program:

2D Window in ArchiCAD had a performance of +1-2 fps in median
3D Window in ArchiCAD had a performance of -2fps in median

HPET was then again disabled via .CMD: bcdedit /set useplatformclock false. Following was observable using a frames per second counter program:

3D Window in ArchiCAD had a performance of +2fps in median
2D Window in ArchiCAD had a performance of -2fps in median
GZ Doom (3D Shooter) had a performance of +10fps in median

it had no effect on the setting of the hardwareacceleration except when HPET and the acceleration were both turned off. Then i experienced a somewhat more fluid 2D flow on zoomed out detail rich plans.


All in all for my system configuration HPET made no real difference if it was turned off/on, so i set it back to default off. This experience might differ with newer systems like Windows 10 as they handle the timer a bit different.



2. FURTHER MICROSOFT SECURITY ESSENTIALS SETTINGS

I also allowed two more exceptions into my MSE.

First was allowing of the process overwatchserver.exe, but i did not experience improvement in performance.

Second was allowing exception for the data type pln.t.c (This is a file which is temporary created by ArchiCAD when it saves a file). When i am saving a ArchicCAD file now it is ultrafast. I have a 500 MB file which took ca. 5 seconds saving time on my system. Now it is done in about a half second. Any experinece from others about this would be appreciated.

Next i will try some exceptions with libraryelements, as several addons tend to slow down my ArchiCAD 20 (MEP to name one).

As before i recommend scanning the excepted files manually from time to time though, as you downgrade system security !


3. FURTHER RECOMMENDATIONS

BLOWING OUT MY COMPUTER CASE WITH COMPRESSED AIR
Well, should be done from time to time, did not do it for a year and after my fans got louder in recent times i did it again last weekend. Now the fans are much more silent again and i experienced a notable performance plus, also in ArchiCAD. I just want to Point out this possibility as this is a common problem.

ENERGYMANAGEMENT OPTIONS
Windows 7 allows in its energy Management Settings to be set on 3 postions which are:
- Maximum Performance,
- Balanced
- Energy saving

Balanced is default in Windows 7. Balanced tends to slow programs at a certain Point. I always run on Maximum Performance. But your pc is going to get hotter and the fans tend to get louder. I also Just want to point out this possibility.



@Dave Seabury
Thank you for your feedback. So this does apparently not work only for MSE but also for a different antivirus program.



@jmayorga
it is difficult for me to consider an advice without system Information. If you could provide me to them i maybe could find a solution. Also a chronological log with description what happened when would be useful. Does your ArchiCAD freezes for several minutes in the initial log ?




CONCLUSION:

Cinerender phones out and i do not know to whom it phones. ArchiCAD stops working if i block this call. Further Evaluation needed. HPET settings had no noticeable effect on my system configuration. Allowing Overwatchserver.exe in MSE had no effect for me. Allowing temporary filetype pln.t.c in MSE did speed up saving significantly.

Please excuse any bad grammar. Any feedback is welcome.

Best regards

Dragan